Wednesday, December 5, 2012

Hamlet Act 4 Fishbowl

154 comments:

  1. Would you consider Hamlet for Ophelias death?

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    1. Yes because Hamlet killed her father which ultimately led to her insanity.

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    2. I think that Hamlet is partially responisible because in a way he was verbal abusing her which could have taken a mental toll on her. She ended up going insane, which led her to her death, and if Hamlet is reponisble for making her insane then he is partially responisible.

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    3. I feel like Hamlet is partially responsible for Ophelia's death because he was so manipulative and used her as a piece in his crazy game. She is a very vulnerable character and it didn't take long for her to go insane.

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    4. No because Hamlet was not even around her when she killed herself, she did it on her own accord. Hamlet may have sparked the craziness but in the end she killed herself not due to Hamlet.

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    5. I think Hamlet is responsible for Ophelia going crazy simply because the way he manipulated her and that he killed her father, one of the few people she cared about anymore. However, Ophelia is responsible for her own actions, therefore she is responsible for her own death

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    6. I feel yes he did because he killed her father and the was the thing that pushed her over the edge but it was not just him it was her father as well.

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    7. Do you mean would I blame Hamlet in part for Ophelia's death? Yes I would blame him in a way. She did go insane do to the fact that Hamlet had killed her father. Studies have shown that a high emotions go up thinking goes down making any logical thought hard to comprehend. As her emotions heightened I believe Ophelia lost her ability to make the right choices even ones having to do with her life.

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    8. I think he definitely played a part in the events leading up to her death, but not the only reason Ophelia died. She had been grieving over the death of her father, but was also trying to comprehend why Hamlet had been acting the way he was. The manipulation Hamlet was inflicting upon her emotions mixed with the sudden death of Polonius, I think ultimately led to her giving up and dying.

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    9. I believe that Hamlet is not directly responsible for Ophilia's death. She obviously loved her father greatly, and that alone made herself go insane. Ophilia's father was there for her, and the father/ daughter relationship was very strong in bond. Now, Hamlet may have had some influence to how Ophilia handled herself in stressful situations but thats all he could have done to feed her insanity.

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  2. In this act we saw a lot of the element of insanity throughout Hamlet and Ophelia. Do you think this has a deeper purpose in the story?

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    1. Hamlet and Ophelia's insanity might represent the fragile nature of humans and how Shakespeare might have believed that people are affected by very emotionally disastrous events

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    2. Yes I believe it has a deeper meaning to the story. The idea of sane vs. insane is highly played upon even to this day. People still are trying to understand how people can switch from logical to illogical thought when traumatic experiences happen to them. This is played upon in Hamlet when we begin to question whither the ghost is real or a figment of Hamlet's imagination that will later drive him to insanity.

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    3. John, excellent in depth Question.I have to agree with Jenna and Addie because humans react to their environment. Whether its a from positive or negative circumstances.You can see that in todays society when kids think suicide is the only way out to their "pain". the Emotion of love is a form of insanity and makes humans do unbelievable things for the people they love. All this connects to the play, Hamlet, and how there is deeper meaning to the play itself.

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  4. Notice that even though this act was to represent more of that father-son relationship, this is the first act in with the Ghost of Hamlet does not appear. Could there be a significance to this absence?

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    1. I feel as though this is symbolic of the fact that Hamlet is truly going insane and that the ghost has lost all cause for getting to Hamlet because it seems that all of Hamlet's endeavors are for his own benefit now than to avenge his father.

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    2. Well the ghost did not appear in Act 2 either, so what is the significance of that?

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  5. Has Hamlet gone insane himself?

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    1. Hamlet has been a little loony for a while now

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    2. You think? Why? How do we know he is not correct about everything he is fighting for?

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    3. Yes because no sane person would ever kill anyone random like Polonius, or try and drive other people to insanity like he did Ophelia. I think Hamlets first intentions were to act insane as part of his plan, but it soon turned to actual insanity.

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    4. This is one thing debated throughout the entire play. Because the narrative mainly shows Hamlet as a victim and a man of inaction, we see a perspective in which the Ghost does exist and his actions of madness are all part of a plan. But after seeing Ophelia truly going mad after her father's death, we must question whether the same thing is happening to Hamlet and only finds himself innocent or if everything that has been put into view means he isn't insane, just after revenge.

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    5. I think he might be a little crazed and obsessed with the thought of revenge, but not necessarily insane.

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    6. He might be right in what he is fighting for but he is not approaching the situation in the way a normal person would. killing someone is never something that should be justified and yelling at your mother is also something that is never right. both of these things is what hamlet has done in the past couple of acts.

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    7. I disagree with you Sam, Hamlet didn't randomly kill Polonius, he was under impression that it was the king who was spying so he tried to kill the king. Polonius's death was purely accident, he was in the wrong place in the wrong time, and he payed the price. Hamlet is not insane in trying to murder the king, he is correct and is acting insane to play it off, which is smart, as opposed to being insane.

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    8. He's just really really stressed out by the fact that his dead dad came back from the grave to tell him that he has to kill his uncle,that he killed his girlfriend's dad and that she committed suicide. He's feeling depressed and stressed. but he's not crazy.

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    9. If you were in Hamlets position and your mother was doing the things she had done and treating you in that way, would you honestly just let that go? Yes, possibly he took it to far, but think about the time period that this was in, it wasn't as far fetched as that type of action would be now, you must consider that. I bet you that if you were in that position you would somehow confront your mom on the situation, and although it would be different, it would be relative.

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    10. If my mom married my uncle,after him killing my father,that would make me Furious. For a number of reason. My mixed emotion's would disgust me on a number of levels.I wouldnt let things Just go without a punishment to my Uncle. If i knew he was responsible for my Fathers death i would want to take matters into my own hands. And if that means killing because im so enraged then i might have to consider the that. Family first is what i believe. I would Kill for the justice of my Family. Wouldnt you?

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  6. What repercussions do you think are going to come from Ophelia's death?

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    1. I think it could possibly push Hamlet over the edge. It's a constant question if Hamlet is actually insane, and once he realizes he partially caused his love to die, he will actually go nuts.

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    2. He might to start contemplating taking his own life because he might find a way to justify suicide since ophelia did.

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    3. I think Hamlet will end up loosing all hope. He was depressed after his father was killed which led to his insainity. I think once it finally sinks in that his love is gone forever he will do something crazy, like kill himself.

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    4. I think Hamlets death will come from Ophelia, because he pissed of a lot of people when he killed Polonius and drove Ophelia to suicide. The king and Laertes even try and plan a way to kill Hamlet. I think the end of Hamlet is near.

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    5. We already know that Laertes has come back full throttle to kill the murderer of his father, who he thought to be Claudius. Obviously Claudius is well aware of Hamlet's intentions to kill him, so I believe Laertes' violence will be manipulated by Claudius and send him towards hating and killing Hamlet.

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  7. What does Ophelia's death symbolize?

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    1. loss of hope because since her father died she felt like she had nothing to live for which led to her insanity which ultimately led to her death.

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    2. The loss of innocence. Thus far, Ophelia has been the most innocent character in the play. Now, with her gone, there are no more characters to turn to as a model of innocence and good.

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    3. I think this also shows more of the idea of women from Shakespeare. It shows how when their father died, Leartes stayed strong, however Ophelia's weak mind could not bear the sadness and from this she went insane and died.

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    4. I think her death represents her weakness. I do think her death was a suicide and any person who takes their own life is helpless. After realizing her father was dead she became very insane and depression followed. Her death was a cry for help.

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    5. I think her death represents the way the people give up in this play. Just like hamlet has kind of given up hope in himself, and how Gertrude gave up on Hamlet her son, and her first husband, Ophelia gave up on her own life.

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  9. What are some trends within Hamlet and Ohpelia in the aspect tha both of their fathers were killed?

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    1. I don't know if there is necessarily a trend but I do feel like they both had extreme reactions. Hamlet formed a vengeful plot to kill his father's murderer while Ophelia just went crazy.

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    2. some familiar trends are the fact that both have gone inane after their fathers death.

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    3. I agree with Jessica. Their actions weren't necessarily trends, because the results were completely different, but both Hamlet and Ophelia may have over reacted to the point of taking more lives than needed

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    4. The deaths of their fathers show the role of the patriarch of the time. The fathers were both manipulative and really showed/told their children how to live and what to do, and how to make decisions, etc. Without that "guidance", Ophelia and Hamlet went pretty insane. In addition to that loss, the grief of losing someone close to one can have incredibly sad repercussions and they also dealt with their grief in bad ways.

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  10. I don't think that hamlet was directly responsible for her death because she was depressed from her father being gone, but he defiantly had a part of her going crazy. He played with her feelings so much and all the people that she loved were gone, that she really didn't have much else to live for.

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  11. Hamlet is responsible for the events leading up to Ophelias death because he killed Polonius, her father, causing her to go mad. she has lost her father, her true love, and feels betrayal.

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  12. Since Ophelia went crazy once her father was killed, don't you think that the fact that Hamlet was her father's murderer plays a large part in her mental state?

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    1. I think this definitely played a huge part in this. Knowing that the man she once loved is the same man that murdered his father must be hard on her mental state, and I think that it led to her insanity.

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    2. I definitely agree because Hamlet has caused stress and sadness before in her life, once she finds out that Hamlet is her father's murderer it just gives her another reason to hate him Hamlet even more and become mentally insane.

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  13. What is the significance of Laertes returning in this act? Do you think something will come of this?

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    1. There possibly is significance but I think it's mainly common sense. His father was killed so obviously he would come back to be with his sister.

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    2. I believe that Laertes return in this act will cause the rest of Denmark to crumble from the inside out even before Fortingbras arrives. Laertes is so mad with grief that he could do something rash in order to get justice. The people of Denmark must really be losing faith in their rules at this point also which will be weakening Claudius's rule.

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  14. Why do you think Hamlet less present in this act than in the previous three?

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    1. This act was mostly about Ophelia and her insanity. I think that Hamlet realized what he did to Ophelia and he wanted to stay away from her.

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    2. I think the reason for this is to show how much Hamlet's actions have affected everyone around him. Polonius is dead, Ophelia is insane then dead, Claudius and Gertrude are extremely paranoid, and Laertes doesn't know what to do. This is all because of Hamlet and I think Shakespeare cuts him out for this small time to show what Hamlet has done.

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    3. I think he's less present in this act because it was mainly focused on how Ophelia was being affected by the events leading up to her death.

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  15. I agree with Kristen, i dont think that Hamlet is responsible for her death because he didn't actually do anything with the intent to kill her, or did he do anything on accident to kill her. He simply expressed his feeling for her in a very emotional and mean way. The emotional instability of Ophelia is what killed her

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  16. Do you believe Laertes will also blame Hamlet for the death of Ophelia?

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    1. Yes, I think he will. Laertes comes home to extreme turmoil in his family, with his father murdered and now his sister's drowning. To Laertes, Hamlet is the only possible suspect, given his history with the family and now that the word is spreading about his insanity.

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  17. What does Ophelia's death show about Shakespeare's portrayal of women? Is Ophelia's character an ultimate example of how easily women were manipulated in Shakespeare's opinion?

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    1. Ophelia's death is a show of how weak women are because she went insane so quickly, showing weakness of the mind and through her emotions. She also was shown as not having any will left to fight to stay alive or anything when she ended up drowning, showing weakness. I don't think that her death necessarily shows how easily she is manipulated, though.

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    2. We see that difference between men and women through Shakespeare's perspective. He killed both Hamlet and Ophelia's fathers, and their reactions are somewhat different due to the fact that Hamlet tries very hard to avenge his father while Ophelia somewhat gave up purpose and became weak and easy to destroy. Overall, Shakespeare shows men as more of action and purpose while women do not respond to problems in life very well.

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    3. Ophelia's death is just one of the examples that Shakespeare uses the say the women are useless. Ophelia was used by her dad, the king, and Hamlet, and I think that her death wont effect many of those men. And Yes I think that this is a perfect example of how women were manipulated, because she couldn't be used or belittled by anyone else.

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  18. Do you believe Gertrude will step in and protect Hamlet from being killed by Laertes or Claudius?

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    1. I don't think that Gertrude is a very supportive mother so I think she will almost brush the thought out of her mind that soemthing bad could happen to her son.

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    2. I think that she is more worried about her own life more so than Hamlets. I think she will be manipulated by Claudius to believe that hamlet deserves what ever he gets.

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    3. I don't think so because Shakespeare really made her character to be weak and vulnerable; not a hero.

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    4. I don't know if this is extremely likely, but it is definitely a possibility. Although Gertrude believes that her son is insane, I also think that since he is her son she will always love him.

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    5. I think that she would protest at first, but if it was Claudius, she would probably ultimately back down and end up not protecting Hamlet.

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    6. I agree with what Jessica said. Gertrude will believe that Hamlet has truly gone mad and believe that his death is for the best.

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    7. I don't think that Gertrude will do anything at this point. Shakespeare makes it really clear that women don't have much say, and that they are weak, and I think he will continue to portray Gertrude the same way. She has never stuck up for her son before, and I don't think that she will.

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    8. No because in the time of Shakespeare women never stood up for themselves or anyone else. He did not give the women characters enough strength to actually stop something bad from happening. So no I don't think Gertrude will step in to save Hamlet.

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  19. Gertrude is afraid to step in or accuse Claudius for the death of the king because she feels being a queen and living in a palace is more important that saving your son and bringing Claudius admit to the crimes. This also portrays how women are weak and indecisive through Shake spears eyes.

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  20. Could you say that everyone that loses a father of a loved one eventually goes crazy in this play?

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    1. you could make that connection to every day life. When you lose someone like your father its really hard to come back from it. In this play both examples have led to insanity but we still have yet to see Laertes to go insane so this argument could be invalid.

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    2. I do not think this will happen to everyone. But I do think its a trend in the younger people. I think that the trend is if you loose a father, you will go insane but I don't think it will happen to eveyone.

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    3. I don't think everyone goes insane, I just think they all have trouble with mourning. The characters that are mourning are either doing it in a peculiar way (Ophelia), or the other characters are pushing them away from their grieving process (Hamlet).

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    4. I think this is a possibility, although this might not be true in modern day, losing a love one obviously takes a toll on someone's mental state.

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  21. From the scenes we watched on Monday, which scene do you think represented Ophelia's insanity the best?

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    1. When she was locked in the straight jacket because that is actually used when people are insane plus she was singing and just looked crazed.

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    2. I think the one with Helena Bonham Carter was the best portrayal because she made the audience uncomfortable, really pushing the limits of insanity.

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    3. I think the last one was the best interpretation because of how insane the director made Ophelia seem. With the straight jacket and how she sees flowers that are nonexistent, Ophelia's insanity is shown strongly.

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    4. They all captured three very different aspects of insanity. I think the third one was the best because you could tell that she had truly lost her mind (faking giving flowers) and her voice was the most beautiful what she was the most crazy.

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    5. I think the second one we watched with Mel Gibson is the best representation of Ophelias insanity. In the movie it perfectly shows how mad and crazy Ophelia can get. It is really kind of creepy how insane she is in the movie.

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    6. Each movie represented Ophelia in very different interpretations. The first just showed her insanity as a sudden quiver she doesnt really notice herself, while the Mel Gibson version had much symbolism and hatred, such as her mad state in dirty clothes and charging around the castle with an angry face. Finally, the last one may have shown the best version of her insanity because she was no longer in touch with reality yet the audience could still feel her motivation towards going insane.

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  22. Is there symbolism in the fact that Ophelia dies by drowning? Could this also have a relationship to the symbolic parts of water such as purity and cleansing?

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    1. Drowning in the lies of her love life.

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    2. I think it symbolizes that she has been drowning in the weight of everyone else's influence.She has been so effected by the people at court and around her that she has lost the fact that she can make her own choices. She was looking for a way out of her drowning in other people.

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    3. I think there might be some symbolism, because like you said, water is a sense of purity and cleansing, but drowning is also one of the slowest and most terrifying ways to die. I think this represents the long suffering of Ophelia, with all the manipulation and loss. Drowning greatly symbolizes her life of long and painful despair

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    4. Ya, Because the water is like her madness/sadness she's just drowning in it. As far as the traditional meaning of water and purifying her. You could say that by drowning herself she is purifying herself of her madness/sadness and cleansing herself of her ties to all the other mad/sad people in her world.

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  23. How do you think knowing that Ophelia killed herself will effect Hamlet? If so how?

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    1. I think that by this time in the story Hamlet has pretty much alienated himself completely from Ophelia and he has no cares for her whatsoever. So, he may remember a time in which they were truly happy, but as of now I think Hamlet will not be effected.

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    2. I think he would react a little bit sadly, but to be honest, I don't really think he would care all that much.

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    3. We don't really know that Ophelia has killed herself though. All the play explains was she was down by the river while the weight of her clothes pulled her down into the water, yet we don't know of it was intentional. Overall, though, Hamlet will respond with much hatred most likely toward himself for causing such dismay just by killing the wrong man.

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    4. I think this will definitely effect Hamlet, his life is already pretty crazy as we know but after hearing about this Hamlet will probably feel guilty for killing her father and regret the past and what he has done to her feelings.

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    5. I agree with John that her death will have little affect at him by this point in the story. Although he does not care for her, he might end up being a little jealous that she was allowed to die when she most likely wanted to, when Hamlet was never able to do that... being the suicidal kid he is.

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    6. Hamlet is so caught up in killing Claudius and his own life, I think he will just disregard Ophelias death and not worry about it. I really don't think it will affect Hamlet that much, but if so it might just make him more mad at Claudius and want to kill him even more.

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    7. I don't think that it will affect Hamlet that much. I think that Hamlet treated her so poorly, and stopped showing any kind of affection toward her, that he's just going to blow it off. I think that the only thing that he really cares about it getting revenge for his father.

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  24. who else thought that the OPHELIA in the black and white version was the most attractive of the three Ophelias displayed in the three different plays?????????

    MUST ANSWER QUESTION!!!!!

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    1. This comment has been removed by the author.

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    2. How dare you disrespect Women like that.

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    3. You're a pig colton show some respect

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    4. DO you really want to start a blogging WAR^^^^ mathew, in was an honest sincere question!!

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    5. def the best. Plus she wasn't as creepy as the other two.

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    6. YE BUT HELENA BONHAM CARTER HAS GOT SOME MAD ACTING SKILLS

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  25. How do you think Rosencrantz and Guildenstern really feel about betraying their friend?

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    1. I think that they are ultimately helping him because they believe he has gone insane so they are trying to protect him from anything bad happening.

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    2. I do not think that Rosencrantz and Guildenstern really care a whole lot about betraying them, because I think they also believe what they are doing is for Hamlet's own good. They seem to believe along with Claudius that Hamlet is insane and they believe that they are helping him.

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    3. I think that in a way, they do feel guilty, but at the same time they both know that in doing what they're doing, they will be helping and protecting Hamlet in the long run.

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    4. I feel as if they are both oblivious to what they are actually doing to their friend. They think they are helping Hamlet by spying on him, but in reality they are not helping him and hurting him from completing his plan.

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    5. Maybe deep down they feel guilt but as we see it they seem as if they could care less. Both characters stick together throughout the play so if they are both betraying Hamlet at the same time their guilt is probably not as strong compared to if only one was doing this mean act to him.

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    6. I don't think it even phases them. I think this because i don't believe that R and G even think that they are betraying Hamlet. They think that they are helping him through a hard time. They think this because they don't know about the conflict between Hamlet, cluadious and Gertrude. If they knew about this then they would have to pick a side.

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    7. Um, they are not his friends so they don't care.

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  26. What is the significance of Ophelia's singing and flowers? Does this relate back to Shakespeare's view of women?

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    1. I think Shakespeare is playing more on the image of a funeral scene then anything else. When someone dies you put flower over their grave in a sign of grief. I think that in doing this with Ophelia Shakespeare is really honoring the tragedy of her death as well as her innocence.

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    2. Usually men give flowers to women, in this case Ophelia is giving flowers to men. I think espically for that time period it was rare for something like that to happen so it truly symbolized Ophelias insanity.

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    3. In the play, Ophelia mentions that she would give Laertes some violets but they have all withered. In a side note violets are supposed to symbolize faithfulness. So Ophelia's faithfulness has withered when her father has passed away.

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  27. Which do you think is more valued in this play, family loyalty or friendship and why?

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    1. I don't really think any are a huge part. It's a very disturbed plot. But I guess loyalty because Hamlet is fighting to avenge his father.

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    2. Most definitely family loyalty. Looking at Rosencrantz and Guildenstern's relationship with Hamlet, it is much weaker than the relationship Hamlet has with his father and mother previous to the king's death. Hamlet and his mother lose their relationship, but that shows the weakness of women. Polonius' family also shows a great deal of family loyalty, as Laertes and Ophelia were extremely hurt by his death.

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    3. I feel that family Loyalty because in the play it shows that Hamlet's friends both betray him by helping his parents.

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    4. Family loyalty. We see multiple instances of revenge and manipulation between families and each family is trying to damage the reputation of one family and advocate for their own.

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    5. I agree, I don't think either of those values are emphasized at all in the play. Loyalty, maybe. But is Hamlet really fighting to avenge his father out of loyalty? Or is there an ulterior motive?

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    6. I think that family loyalty is more valued because Laertes, Hamlet, and Fortinbras, all have lost their fathers, and are trying to give their family a better name. Fortinbras is going off to get a piece of land to show his strength and fighting for something that matters to him. Laertes is figuring out a plan to get back at the Hamlet did to his father. And lastly Hamlet is trying to bring justice to his fathers death. So all of these men are trying to bring back a good name to their families and trying to bring justice back from crimes against their names.

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  28. How do you think his fathers death will affect Laertes??

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    1. I think he will act similar to Hamlet in the sense that he wants to avenge his father and kill Hamlet. Also, Hamlet messed with his sister AND killed his dad so I don't think he is too happy.

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    2. Laertes definitely seems sad about this, however not even close to the same level as Ophelia. I feel that Laertes thinks he needs to stay strong because he is taking over the family name.

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    3. He has shown that the death of his father has made him vengeful as well as grief filled. I think he will end up trying to kill Hamlet but then realize the plot that has lead to this fight and will turn on Claudius.

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    4. Laertes will probably have a similar reaction to Hamlet, when Hamlet is driven by rage. I could see Laertes being more of a man of action than Hamlet, though, and actually killing Hamlet to avenge his father while Hamlet has yet to kill his fahter's killer after being given multiple chances.

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    6. I think he's going to want to get some mad revenge at any cost.

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    7. Laertes seems like a man of action though. I agree that He is similar to Hamlet in his feelings but i think that he will get something done about it. Laertes appears to be more of a man of action.

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  29. What do you think will be the downfall of Denmark, Fortingbras or the royal family themselves?

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    1. First the royal family and then Fortinbras will attack while they're weak.

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    2. I think that Hamlet will give the throne to fortinbras.

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  30. One detail in this act was the flowers Ophelia carried and explained their symbolism. Why these certain flowers and meanings? Why were violets shriveled due to her father's death?

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  31. How does Hamlet fulfill the tragic hero characteristics? What is his tragic flaw?

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  32. Fortinbras shows and exerts his power by taking over a small useless piece of land. This shows a man of action, who is assertive and won't back down.he takes action unlike Hamlet who is skeptical and a coward

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    1. Fortinbras may take some action, but it is over a worthless piece of land so its pointless. It makes it seem he is going out to fight people just to fight. He is almost just as bad as Hamlet since he didn't even try and do anything good.

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  33. How do you predict Hamlet will feel after he avenges his father? Will he feel any differently from how he felt before he knew what Claudius had done?

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    1. I feel like Hamlet killing Claudius will give him some closure about his fathers death.

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    2. He will feel accomplished in the fact that he avenged his father

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    3. I think he will regret his actions in ways. He will have sunk to the level Claudius has and he will regret become so low of actions. I believe he will also regret the pain it will bring his mother and the dishonor it will bring his name. Plus I don't think that he will have proven Clausius had done what he did which will make others see it as unjustified.

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  34. How can a ghost be real one time and not the other?

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    1. I think the ghost appeared with different levels of Hamlet's grieving for his father.

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    2. Well ghosts don't exist so it was never real

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